Why is this particular revision the one you’ve been waiting for, as compared to any of the previous DLSS implementations?

“Hey, do you know where I could find more information on hammers?”

“Yeah, look for all the idiots with broken windows because they decided they didn’t like using keys! Hahuhaha”

It’s quite fun to assume everyone but you is an idiot, but I am in fact aware of that xkcd, and more importantly the myriad benefits of blending in. That doesn’t mean that having another potential tool wouldn’t be useful in specific situations.

I enjoy keeping up with red team style covert infiltration tools and hearing about what actually works in the field for the professionals that do this shit for a living. This video is mostly a guy having fun showing off how much of his own company’s stuff he can fit in a suit, but it gets the point across and touches a little on sureptitious use when he talks about his RFID cloner.

My specific interest in a group investigating this sort of thing was in the actual testing and investigation. To see if anyone had managed to actually test the “overwhelm them with IR” urban legend against any modern equipment, because the last serious test of it that I’m aware of was a decade ago, and the resulting “hat” was obvious as fuck like the hypothetical in the XKCD.

I’ve done a quick search and found a slightly more recent experiment done in 2018 attempting to fool facial recognition instead of just blinding it. Vice overview here, arxiv paper here.

The hat is still pretty damn conspicuous if you ask me:

But it’s also 8 years old.

I’m curious on if modern camera equipment like FLOCK has just spent the extra few cents per 100 units for an IR filter, and if the massive strides forward with LED tech might allow for something less horrendously obvious.

I suspect that the most easy and covert method (if you don’t care about adding property damage and the like to your rap sheet if caught) is still just to use a stupid high powered laser to burn out the camera sensor from outside the angle it covers.

Great callout!

I participate in the techtakes community on awful.systems, which is devoted to laughing at tech bro “takes”. HN posts and comments are almost too easy as targets for derision and are common topics for meta-discussion of the reprehensible opinions.

I was just trying to have a light touch here. Start with the facts. We can talk about the literal cults spun off from it later.

The site’s one of the clearest windows into the myriad and shockingly widespread ghoulish opinions that seem to fester in places that consider themselves important to the tech industry or attract people who think they are.

I really should start keeping a tally on shit like “how many times have I seen eugenics suggested on HN this month”.

Mostly, escaping my mother and allowing me to begin to build healthy boundaries with her.

I grew up with parents who are both near assuredly ADHD, my mother has severe narcisistic tendencies, and my father means well but was fairly absent (overworks himself and is forgetful of plans).

They also had a ton of marital friction and issues that I ended up caught up in the middle of. I’m honestly shocked they didn’t divorce, but they do seem to finally work now as a couple.

Anyway, benefits to me (mostly escaping trauma):

Being able to choose how I spend my time, without my mother constantly trying to steer it to uses she considered “productive”, without constant judgement of my hobbies as somehow being some net negative against my future life prospects. I don’t have to justify every choice and action I make that doesn’t match up to my mother’s messed up idea of how my life should work or what she (incorrectly) thinks would make me more organized/responsible/whatever the fuck.

I’ve been able to actually take the time and figure out what works for me instead of hopping on whatever harebrained fad idea my mother has that has been further filtered through her own issues and her family’s massive anxiety about appearances.

I’m allowed to give up on a course of action when I realize it’s a lost cause, rather than beat my head into paste and continue grinding my neck stump against the same wall.

And I can’t overstate the weight off my shoulder from just not having to deal with the constant judgement, and the constant comparison to people in my age range who she hardly fucking knew but somehow felt qualified to tell me precisely how they were successful (she was wrong most of the time because I already knew these kids better than her, but that didn’t stop her).

I have a space that’s mine. I don’t need to worry about what I leave out, or how it appears to people who don’t have to live in it. I don’t need to worry about someone kicking in a door because I dared not to engage in a screaming match.

While I can’t help myself from memorizing footfalls, I don’t have to arrange myself and my space when I hear someone upset, bracing for impact.

Non-trauma benefits: I can do whatever I want with my space, and unless I invite someone into it I’m the only one effected or judging it.

I can organize in ways that make sense for me.

I can invite people over for any reason at all, even just to hang out with no real plan or goal.

If I can’t find something, or something is messy, I can’t (correctly or not) hide behind it being someone else’s fault or problem.

If I decide I don’t like something, I can change it.

I can leave a project half done and not have to move it out of the way so it won’t get messed with.

Heads up, Hacker News is a social media site like here or reddit, it’s not a news outlet. It’s run by Y Combinator, a huge venture capital firm in the SF Bay area, and the users tend to be tech bros or aspiring ones. Many attach their user accounts to their github and professional identity. I think there’s only one admin and they tend to be heavy handed.

Where might one find that community?

Oh, good. I was worried the balls were one of those butt rip cord starters.

You fight like a dairy farmer!

I have literally never seen this occur outside of:

• it attempting to reset the default PDF viewer multiple times
• twice when the entire group of settings related to cortana/internet search from the taskbar changed and they didn’t attempt to map previous choices to the new settings

That was over the course of a literal decade, most of it with a day job working IT and sysadmin in a Windows environment.

If you’ve got more hard evidence of MS doing this I’d love to see it, but as far as I can tell this comes from the same place that has resulted in every support thread saying you need to run “SFC /scannow”.

If I recall right, they were getting rid of one older unsupported way to do that, but multiple news outlets misread it as getting rid of the ability to bypass at all and then the story got spread from there.

My guy you literally linked some guy fucking around in Special K as supposedly an explanation of the tech, you misread a marketing headline as being technically descriptive, and yourself even admit that it uses AI to generate which is the common usage nowadays for the label.of slop.

I definitely appreciate being called close minded, an asshole, and compared to MAGA for not agreeing with your personal stick up your ass about what you think is proper terminology though.

Have a rotten day.

I’ve not been an asshole here, you’ve consistently talked down at everyone calling this slop due to some minor technicality in terminology that you’ve still failed to back up or expand on beyond linking to the same video a second time.

You also have really zeroed in on some claims that I’ve literally never heard anyone make:

It is not changing geometry. It is changing lighting. It is changing material properties.

No one has said shit about geometry, lighting, or materials because that is not the level at which DLSS operates. Both in previous versions and in this latest version.

It’s not what anyone thinks is going on here, and it calls into question your own understanding of all this that you’ve now insisted upon it twice. It’s not making lighting and materials changes. You’re confusing raytracing which is often turned on and off in graphics presets alongside DLSS because of the intense resource usage, but it is not part of DLSS. Go download a mod for finer grained graphics settings controls in Cyberpunk 2077 and that much will be made clear.

There are plenty of tools people can use to get an idea of how any games’ rendering pipline works, such as Special K as shouted out by the video you linked. Personally I like Reshade for getting a look at render passes, output targets, buffers etc.

DLSS operates on a completed “flat” render output/buffer. As far as I’m aware, It has no knowledge of geometry, materials, or shaders unless the devs are really doing wacky shit and have direct line to nvidia devs. Maybe they’re passing it the depth and normal buffers as well as the flat render output. That opens a lot of options (see marty’s RTGI shader) but is demonstrably still just working with slightly more than gets slapped on the screen as a flat raster image.

It can do edge detection as movement detection through comparing a number of the previous input frames using the types of techniques used in video compression to detect and handle movement, as the end of your video makes small mention of.

Usually it’s used on the output of the 3d render pipeline before the flat HUD elements are slapped on top. Apparently a lot of games the guy that made the video tested didn’t seperate out the HUD layer, or maybe it had something to do with his previous methodology. I’m not watching multiple of his videos to check, and I find it kind of hilarious that someone would think they were some voice of knowledge on how this stuff works if they put the kind of effort they indicated they had for their previous videos without using Special K.

I had already watched the video you linked. I’ve now watched it twice to ensure I didn’t miss anything.

It’s some guy playing with the features in Special K that allow you to utilize DLSS at arbitrary upscalong ratios while allowing HUD elements to render at the viewport resolution. It has nothing to do with the underlying tech or how DLSS works beyond showing that the defaults in most games could be better tuned.

He has a short bit talking about older anti-aliasing tech, then says that DLSS is an advancement without actually getting into how it works.

In all 18 minutes, there is hardly 60 seconds discussing the actual tech, and it literally uses the term generation.

So to be clear, since you seem to be highly mistaken about this: DLSS uses image generation technology along with some very fancy edge detection to attempt to fill in gaps and generate extra details that are not present in the original image.

It is not rendering only the needed sections at higher resolution or anything along those lines, but I can see how someone may think that was implied by your video.

So again, now that I hopefully have shown you that I do in fact know more than a decent bit about how DLSS works, and you still have not provided more to back up your point beyond a video of some guy fucking around with Special K and going “whoa cool”…

What part of DLSS generating image data that does not exist in a lower resolution source image and using it to fill in what would otherwise be repeated pixels in a traditionally upscaled (nearest neighbor, bilinear, trilinear, etc) image… how is that not generative?

Edit:

Would it kill you to not double the length of your goddamn comment after posting it?

I’ve got better things to do at this point than continue this, but at a glance I see that you took Nvidia’s news post’s wording as gospel.

Edit again:

It’s clear now, you got hung up on some misleading marketing wording in one of the headlines. You even admit it uses AI to generate additional image data. Stop being condescending.

Fine then. Make it clear how it is not approproate to label this generative AI. That’s the basis of your claim that everyone else is being sloppy. Back it up with more than just your own declaration.

Even here you’ve not backed up your beliefs or statements with anything beyond restating your original point.

To anyone just glancing at the promo before and after image, this appears to just be applying image generating AI toolchain tech to the preexisting frame generation. There is at least some amount of responsibility on nvidia for using an image that gives off this look.

Pretending that a reasonable conclusion that a large amount of people are drawing simply isn’t reasonable, and that it is for reasons entirely self-evident, is just masturbation.

I think that being a purist about terminology misses the point and substance of the complaints people have about this.

Three of those are the same thing (AI features) and all are easily handled through group policy.

You are using a version the has group policy right? Spoofing a Pro license with MAS Grave takes roughly 2 minutes from opening the website to finished, on a slow connection.

It’s even easier if you don’t set up a Microsoft Account during install of the OS. You did take the 30 seconds to look up the current bypass when you started, right?

It’s even easier than that if you just don’t use Microsoft Office. Open source office suites work fine on Windows.

Of course, Linux is the easiest way.

If you don’t take 30 seconds to look up the bypass on install. If you’re capable of switching to Linux it’s hardly forced in any way that matters.

Yep. Imagine that, using the specialist version of the OS strips out a lot of the bullshit.

I’ll never argue that the suck inherent to Windows is OK, but anyone who thinks it’s somehow completely unavoidable just isn’t trying. It’s always kind of shocking to see Linux users, who are at least on paper tech savvy, have complaints that include shit that can be disabled by toggling a single switch in a top level settings menu. Meanwhile they’ll act like some of the arcane hoops needed to fix shit like sleep mode, hdr, or audio on some combinations of hardware and distro is just par for the course.

Personally, I find the better approach to convert folks isn’t to create an insane caricature of the issues with Windows, but to go “here’s the list of all the stuff you need to do to fix Windows, or you can sidestep it entirely with Linux but risk occasional strange hardware compatibility problems”

These are tools, not religion.

Because people miss that this happened over 100 years ago, right?

These kinds of people aren’t doing much of anything lately, unless they’re undead. This happened back in 1897.

The fuck I am.

You’re the one that equivocated military service (and implied killing through it) to simply

[choosing] wellbeing over others’ lives

Choosing wellbeing over others’ lives is the thing almost all of us do almost fucking constantly, and explicitly what I was talking about.

Military service and murdering people is not.

Edit: Draw your line in the sand wherever you want, murder is a perfectly valid line to have and one I agree with.

Just don’t pretend that you don’t choose wellbeing over others’ lives too. If your issue is with military service and murder, stick with that.